I've been quietly lurking and checking out the posts here and wanted to pose
a query to you all...I discovered Wicca 12 years ago through a college friend and it
changed my life, giving me comfort and acceptance
of being a woman and strength to achieve many goals. I went to a Wiccan
meeting group once a week that eventually spun off some wonderful friendships,
unfortunately some that I'm no longer in communication with. Most of that
group has kind of gone off the deep end in terms of being cult-ish and doomsday
prophecy stuff. I've also had arguments with my very best friend that almost ruined
our friendship about being poly (she is and I'm not) and with different pagan people
saying that "If you're not poly you're not pagan" Quite frankly, I've see so many
people get involved in the poly thing and it almost always
turns into a mess.. now that I'm married and in a committed
relationship to hear that theme in the community, rubs me the wrong way.
I've spent so much time in Salem, MA that the whole flaming pentacle/cloak wearing/
black cat and moon thing makes me shudder. I've spent the past 7 years building
my mehndi business and taking control of my life that some in the community have
said "I've sold out" and I'm not spiritual or eco-conscious anymore because I'm more focused on my
business. Frankly, I realized that the people that I
spent too much time with had communal goals within the group that did not allow
me to fulfill my individual goals. I've also met many pagans that turned me off to the religion
because they were irresponsible and used the fact that they were pagan to be
irresponsible..ever hear of "pagan standard time"??
So, I'm not trying to be a downer here. I know there are many people that
walk the walk and are role models for just being outstanding citizens, not just pagans.
I'm blessed to have several still within my group of friends. But I feel
like I'm done with Wicca. I see a pentacle and it does'nt have the same meaning for
me it once did. I see a goddess statue and while I admire it for its beauty
it does'nt hit me like it used to. Sort of like watching your favorite movie
100 times, after the 34th performance it loses its oomph. I don't want to
lean on my pagan friends to get my fire started again, if that's even the
direction I want to go towards, I've found through my research into
Indian and Middle Eastern cultures via my henna business a lot of
profound wisdom that speaks to me but not like Wicca did.
Has anyone else out there experienced pagan burnout or just religious burnout
in general??
Respectfully Submitted,
Maria
a query to you all...I discovered Wicca 12 years ago through a college friend and it
changed my life, giving me comfort and acceptance
of being a woman and strength to achieve many goals. I went to a Wiccan
meeting group once a week that eventually spun off some wonderful friendships,
unfortunately some that I'm no longer in communication with. Most of that
group has kind of gone off the deep end in terms of being cult-ish and doomsday
prophecy stuff. I've also had arguments with my very best friend that almost ruined
our friendship about being poly (she is and I'm not) and with different pagan people
saying that "If you're not poly you're not pagan" Quite frankly, I've see so many
people get involved in the poly thing and it almost always
turns into a mess.. now that I'm married and in a committed
relationship to hear that theme in the community, rubs me the wrong way.
I've spent so much time in Salem, MA that the whole flaming pentacle/cloak wearing/
black cat and moon thing makes me shudder. I've spent the past 7 years building
my mehndi business and taking control of my life that some in the community have
said "I've sold out" and I'm not spiritual or eco-conscious anymore because I'm more focused on my
business. Frankly, I realized that the people that I
spent too much time with had communal goals within the group that did not allow
me to fulfill my individual goals. I've also met many pagans that turned me off to the religion
because they were irresponsible and used the fact that they were pagan to be
irresponsible..ever hear of "pagan standard time"??
So, I'm not trying to be a downer here. I know there are many people that
walk the walk and are role models for just being outstanding citizens, not just pagans.
I'm blessed to have several still within my group of friends. But I feel
like I'm done with Wicca. I see a pentacle and it does'nt have the same meaning for
me it once did. I see a goddess statue and while I admire it for its beauty
it does'nt hit me like it used to. Sort of like watching your favorite movie
100 times, after the 34th performance it loses its oomph. I don't want to
lean on my pagan friends to get my fire started again, if that's even the
direction I want to go towards, I've found through my research into
Indian and Middle Eastern cultures via my henna business a lot of
profound wisdom that speaks to me but not like Wicca did.
Has anyone else out there experienced pagan burnout or just religious burnout
in general??
Respectfully Submitted,
Maria
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Re: burnt out on Wicca?
Wed, August 22, 2007 - 7:50 AMI got burned out on the people too. I know many who have too. Most poeple I know who get burned out on the people (like me) usually become solitaire Pagans/Wiccans. I do know what yo mean when people use Paganism/Wicca as an excuse for their bad behavior.
When I became a solitare I ended up meeting a more broad range of people who are Pagan/Wiccan or of other religion. The most interesting thing is that how many Pagan/Wiccan who stay away from public group for one reason or another. It is funny. I have met a larger slice of Wiccans/Pagans outside of the public groups. I have met, Dark Pagans/Wiccans, professionals, business owners, mechanics, Burn Man Pagans/ Wiccans. The most interesting this is that in this larger slic you will find Pagan/Wiccans who are not in the SCA. Do not go to Ren Faires. Do not LARP or play D&D. Most of all watch videos of Firefly/Serenity all day.
=:)
Just do your own thing. I mean we are Pagans and Wiccans. Traditionally we do not follow molds. We do our own thing. So just do it!
Cross 4.2
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Re: burnt out on Wicca?
Wed, August 22, 2007 - 7:54 AMi wish we lived closer.
i could use a friend like you! ")
i pretty much feel the same way, although i do still feel bonded with Wicca,
in my humble onion, its become so commercialized and saturated with wanna-bes, its a mess.
i now know why people climb to the top of the mountain....i've been looking for a mountain my Self, lol
i;ve turned to my art work and gotten back into jewelry making, finding that a lot of my spiriutality comes thru in that.
heres to Spirituality!
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Re: burnt out on Wicca?
Wed, August 22, 2007 - 10:17 AMIm not burnt out on wicca,just the people that inhabit it. You can say exactly the same thing for any religion....religion is not a thing or can be nailed down, it is compliled by members...look at the root of the word....LIG...to tie/bind. Its not the religion.
Thats why catholics get turned off, (by looking at the membership) thats why people get turned off by some tribes (look at the wicca tribes and tell me that you arent sick of allot of the people that monopolize the tribes)..
so dont get turned off by the religion, get turned off by the membership.
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Re: burnt out on Wicca?
Wed, August 22, 2007 - 11:14 AMIn my opion its the religis zelices that burnd me out strait across the bord
we joind groops in the beganing I think to lurn tecneak and maybe gain confidence but that confidence is a duble edge sword
seek not the validation from out side your self go inwerd
witch craft, wicca and pagonisom
is pure its the belivers to the extream I can do with out
lol E -
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Re: burnt out on Wicca?
Wed, August 22, 2007 - 12:54 PM"I discovered Wicca 12 years ago through a college friend and it
changed my life, giving me comfort and acceptance
of being a woman and strength to achieve many goals."
This part sounds personal and internal, the best part of occult religions. Everything else you list sounds like annoyance with other folks. This is the big distinction, as far as I can tell. Perhaps removing yourself from the icky energy vamps, going more solitary, and just letting the Natural world relax and recharge you will help.
Ditch the labels and the judgments (to and fro) and find what it was that attracted you to the Craft in the first place: the connection with the Seasons and the Goddess. -
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Re: burnt out on Wicca?
Wed, August 22, 2007 - 10:37 PMI agree with what's being said here, too. I belong to a small circle, but for the most part maintain my solitary status. Yeah, I've met some truly wonderful people within the Craft, but yes, so very very many of those whose paths I've crossed are those with whom I don't really care to weave my energy. I love the toys and props as much as any of us, but the heart of paganism, for me anyway, isn't in those things...it's in the feeling of my bare feet on wet grass with the wind in my hair and the sunlight on my skin. It's about noticing when the leaves start to turn and knowing that the days are getting shorter.
Maybe you *are* done with Wicca. Maybe you're just burnt with the people who complicate it in your mind. Maybe you'd be happier solitary. Whichever way, as long as you act in an ethical and loving way, it's all okay. -
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Re: burnt out on Wicca?
Thu, August 23, 2007 - 6:02 AMbut the heart of paganism, for me anyway, isn't in those things...it's in the feeling of my bare feet on wet grass with the wind in my hair and the sunlight on my skin. It's about noticing when the leaves start to turn and knowing that the days are getting shorter.<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
what a great way to say it!
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Re: burnt out on Wicca?
Thu, August 23, 2007 - 10:54 AMEach left home and hearth without a word
Answering a call that none save they could hear
One by one they walked into the darkened woods
Shedding their clothes as they went
Following an unseen path unerringly through the mist
They felt the music long before the fire light reached their eyes
Each emerged into the clearing and
Stepping down into the hollow they began to dance
The fire was just tall enough for each it seemed
To see the eyes of those across the flames
A dozen bodies moved to the music each heard clearly
Yet which never left the Hollow
As they circled the flames
They began moving closer to each other
Hands touching hands
Then lips meeting, warm and filled with Joyous passions
Soon they were joined in another Dance
All together more Rhythmic & Primal
As the music faded into the songs of joy & release
For hours they danced on the soft mossy banks of this sacred place
Before dawn they began to stumble out of the Bowl
Now lit by only dying embers
Following the trails of clothes each had left behind
Back to their cold hearths after a night of Revels Primal
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
David Davis
Copyright 2007 -
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Re: burnt out on Wicca?
Sun, October 28, 2007 - 9:19 PMThis was very good. Thanks for posting it.
MP & BB
John
))0((
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Re: burnt out on Wicca?
Wed, August 22, 2007 - 9:13 PMI feel the same way...Its not so much the religion as it is the people who use and abuse it for destructive ways...This happens in every religion but it seems like if you want to do drugs,have unprotected sexual encounters with many and varied people..it is ok if your "pagan"..this makes it very hard to debunk and get past all the misconceptions and not so flattering myths we have suffered..One step foward and two steps kinda thing..i tend to stay to myself and a few close people but do not venture too much in the mainstream..Some days it is very dishearting to see so many people abuse what is scared to us..Blessed Be and Peace to you..
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Unsu...
Re: burnt out on Wicca?
Thu, August 23, 2007 - 6:43 AMI can understand where you are coming from. Perhaps you just need a break for awhile to recharge and regroup and connect with it personally? Sometimes we need to get away from something to come back and connect on a new level. Nothing wrong with that. I too, stayed away from Wicca for many years because of some of the pagans I met. I just wanted you to know I can relate.
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Re: burnt out on Wicca?
Sun, October 28, 2007 - 5:08 PMwow, i SOO feel you on this. i have felt the same way for a while now, and am only now making an effor tjust to get to know the people again. its been years since i was involved. i like the beleifs and i get along with wiccans well but i no longer feel like i can cal myself one, it no longer holds the passion for me in once did, a lot of it is the people but mostly because it simply does not hold what i need within it. im looking for more understanding of more masculine divinity, and the balance and give and take of relationships, and wicca seems so one sided, im not a woman, i appreciate women, i respect women, like my momma taught me, but my own needs are different and wicca simply does not hold what i need anymore. but i like the people and i like the conversations, and the openness and acceptance. these are all good things, but i dont think i can call myself a wiccan anymore, i just dont fit that mold.
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Unsu...
Re: burnt out on Wicca?
Mon, October 29, 2007 - 7:39 AMThe only true church is within the heart. Go there. -
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Re: burnt out on Wicca?
Mon, October 29, 2007 - 8:47 PMI agree, but its awfully ahrd to share that sometimes when people are so caught up in their own limitations.
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Unsu...
Re: burnt out on Wicca?
Sun, December 2, 2007 - 12:15 PMI became burned out on wicca/paganism after someone in our coven turned to Satanism and ruined her life in the process. I was the target of her hostility fueled by jealousy. Evil spirits really do exist. Negative energy really does come back to the sender. The whole thing really disappointed me. i joined this tribe as an attempt to rejoin paganism and try again. -
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Re: burnt out on Wicca?
Wed, December 5, 2007 - 10:51 AMI've been a practicing pagan for over 12 years now, I used to refer to myself as 'wiccan' but it just seems to much of a stereo type of it's own, so now I just say I am pagan and leave it at that. I agree with the basic flow of most of this thread.
One thing that bothered me though when reading through random posts here in different areas, now I quite agree with everyone here, I got burnt out on the people for the most part too, I stay to myself other than a few friends I've met who do not follow my exact path, and we get along great, but where on earth did you get the idea that just because you were wiccan/pagan whatever that there were no bad spirits?
Satanists are rather odd, and quite frankly I ignore or avoid the vast majority of them myself, but why leave wiccan/paganism because you see bad "evil" if you will spirits?
Things are not always rosey, and there is good and bad in anything, including the spirit world, in all things there is balance. Now unfortunetially if you open yourself to things such as your friend did you can rather tend to call the negative entities to yourself. One would ask you to take another look at protective circles and cleaning out negative energies, and other such house cleaning and protective rituals and ask yourself why people do them.
I apologize, I'm a person that on occassion seems to come out sarcastic when I in no way mean to, and I might be now, but m'dear you should never have to have it proven to you or even to tell someone that "evil spirits exist". That is a given. There is good and bad in everything. What I would suggest though is that if you were harmed by those entities that you should have done a thorough cleansing of your home, put up protective wards to keep entities like that out, and I must say that it's a good thing your friend went elsewhere.
Honestly when learning about the occult one of the very first things you should learn is how to protect, defend and cleanse.
I really hope that your negative experience rather than hinder you as it seems to have done, helps you grow. I would also suggest you read a lot before you work with ritual again. Books by Scott Cunningham, and Raymond Buckland and many many other very good authors not only teach you how to keep negative energies from you and banish those that do find there way there, but ways to keep your home in harmony, how to foster good energies around you, and many other things that I believe should be a lot of what you learn at first.
Love and Light,
Anwaset -
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Re: burnt out on Wicca?
Wed, December 5, 2007 - 11:34 AM>> ... I got burnt out on the people for the most part too, I stay to myself other than a few friends ... <<
Back in the day, when those Christians first came along, one of the standard criticisms of Christianity was that it is a religion that one has to be taught. Pagans had always assumed (and still do mostly) that what is right and good about "religion" (or "spirituality" or whatever you want to call it) is also "what comes naturally". We can learn and study lots of things - lore, magic, rituals, herbs, systems of symbolism, methods of healing, etc - but the basic fundamental connection with the Divine isn't something that has to be "revealed" to anyone. All human beings have always had that and always will - at least anyone who wants to.
I think a crucial turning point for modern Paganism came with the proliferation of books that encouraged people to be Pagans on their own. The "first wave" of Wicca was very focussed on covens and group work. But authors like Cunningham and others really did encourage people to just BE Pagan - without necessarily needing to JOIN anything.
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Unsu...
Re: burnt out on Wicca?
Thu, December 6, 2007 - 11:12 AMIt was I who left her where I found her and it was HER LIFE that fell apart not mine! The rest of our coven was great and perhaps as someone said we need to focus on what we get right and not just on mistakes. I loved the fellowship and fun we had together. I loved helping to put on public rituals that were attended by many in the pagan community. But I can tell by the responses that I touched a nerve in some people ... perhaps because , deep down inside, you know that these are serious issues that can't be washed over or ignored.
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Re: burnt out on Wicca?
Sun, January 27, 2008 - 8:28 AMyes I did burn out and as of recently I have been feeling called back to it. I beleive that for me it wasn't the repetition of rituals or the tings involved. It was that i needed to get my life in order first. It's very important as a wiccan. It makes one a stronger at what they do. Religion that denies life is extremists and every religion I have come accross has a middle path and extreme paths to the left, right and all over the place. I was also disgusted by the maturity level of those claiming to be wiccan. But i think maybe someday your experiences with these people might fade and this practise might come alive for you again. I always kinda missed it a little but it just wasn't the time to come to it. wicca is supposed to be non dogmatic and if you feel that your path must lead elsewhere away from being wiccan whether temporarily or permanently a person must honor their heart and the direction it wants to go. We must do what we must. i beleive in freedom and if a religion caused bondage of spirit it isn't a true form of liberation.
Instead of saying the oversaid "Blessed Be" I'll say instead
Good luck and good health to you to acheive whatever you wish!
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Unsu...
Re: burnt out on Wicca?
Sun, January 27, 2008 - 5:19 PMI guess you can call me a wanderer, A lone ranger if you will. I find the best way not to get burned out on something is not to get too involved or attached to anything. I love to wander though the halls of belief and see what I can gather for my personal path, Its like beach combing, looking for agates. Once I find all i can, I move on. Too me, all are based on love because that is all there is. All the rest is fodder that can be dispensed with when used up, but love is forever. Its the only thing that can save you, or just get you through the night. Peace
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Re: burnt out on Wicca?
Sun, February 3, 2008 - 9:47 PMMaria I can relate,,,,I feel that way as well. -
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Re: burnt out on Wicca?
Wed, February 20, 2008 - 4:55 PMYa know, I read this post and all the related posts and the words couldn't come at a better time.
I never realized people could be as evil or mean-spirited as I discovered when I connected to a certain Pagan community. I ran a store. spent A LOT of time doing this as I arranged classes, book signings, meetings, field trips, drum circles, readers, you name it. I also did a lot of marketing and meeting of the masses, including volunteering with the local inter-faith community. What did I get for my works? Pain. Granted I wasn't looking for recognition or praise or anything in return. Just some common courtesy would have been nice.
So it's really damn easy to stand back and say "there is good and bad in everything" and just go along with it 'cause that's the way it is. But when you are deep in the middle of it, in despair, sorrow, anguish, and surrounded by malicious people, well, thinking about how wonderful the world is... doesn't exist.
Then there are those who state you aren't truly Wiccan or Pagan if you don't do this or that, or believe in this or that. Or the book-smart people who can quote authors all day long but never give you a truly spiritual experience to relate. Not one word of insight. Not one one topic of interest. If the author said it, it must be true, right? Not. Those who only relate what we barely know from minimal archeology on Celtic worship or other forms of ancient Pagan practices. "It has to be done this way 'cause that's what they (authors) are telling us!" Right.
I could go on and on about how people act in the Pagan world, but as I have read, a lot of you have experienced it. It does have an effect on your religion, but not necessarily your spirituality. I still believe and follow a Pagan path, but tend to keep to myself. I got "burned-out" on Wicca though because I saw true hypocrisy in nearly the entire community, that it became nothing more than an empty religion, for those who used it as an excuse to be irresponsible assholes. Don't get me wrong, I still know some wonderful Pagans, but it doesn't match the shear numbers of bad ones I ran in to.
So now I don't call myself anything in particular. I am Pagan, yes, and I follow the nature path, leaning towards Celtic. Celtic Witch if anything.
I have very seriously considered starting a new tribe for those who truly follow Paganism as a spiritual path, and not a book-read path, or "do what you want" path or "excuse" path (Pagan standard time LOL), or a "my coven told me this" path. This tribe would be just for those who have had spiritual experiences, personal connections with the gods, goddesses, elementals, dragons, fae, whatever, or have questions regarding such (or say dream/meditation interpretation), not for what is "right" or what a book said/says, or what the coven says, etc. just for those who have had real experiences. Would anyone be interested in that? -
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Re: burnt out on Wicca?
Thu, February 21, 2008 - 4:41 AMhow would you screen your applicants?
but yeah id be interested, just wary of the ONE TRUE PATH followers,
makes me think of yet another pagan fad of hypocrisy coming on. -
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Re: burnt out on Wicca?
Thu, February 21, 2008 - 9:40 AMJust like any open forum, it's hit or miss. All you can do is say in the tribe description what it's for, notate that if there is a deviation then they could be removed from the list. Hopefully when the description is read, those who are more interested in "what the right way is" will not bother joining.
""just wary of the ONE TRUE PATH followers,
makes me think of yet another pagan fad of hypocrisy coming on""
It's too bad we have to worry about people like that. But unfortunately it exists. All we can do is be wary of them and surround ourselves with better people.
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Re: burnt out on Wicca?
Fri, February 22, 2008 - 6:44 AMMaria,
I have seen this "phenomenon" many times and experienced it myself. I am also a hetero "GASP" woman in a committed closed relationship "DOUBLE GASP"!! It would be a shame if you left the fold of the Goddess and the old Ways because of ignorant cooky people who have no formal training in witchcraft and who are not doing their deep inner work. Witchcraft is a living breathing religion, spirituality and daily practice it is not about black cats and hats and pentacles. There ARE mature educated pagan folk out there who have responsible lives and who worship and live a pagan life. It sounds like you have grown out of the greater wiccan pagan communities. Have you ever considered researching other traditions of Witchcraft besides generic Wicca?
Blessings to you in your struggles and in your discoveries...
In darkness and light
Maya -
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Re: burnt out on Wicca?
Fri, February 22, 2008 - 11:17 AMWait... I don't get a hat? -
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Re: burnt out on Wicca?
Fri, February 22, 2008 - 12:30 PMno, you only get a hat , a MAGICAL hat, if you pass the supreme high muckety mucks test of supreme faithfullness, which involves a rubber chicken, two otters, summoning the spirit of LARRY the arch accountant of hellish affairs, and successfully dancing an Irish jig backwards to Iron Butterflys "Inna Gatta Davita". oh and a healthy donation to the coffers of said establishment couldnt hurt.
THEN you get the hat.
ITS a MAGICAL hat.
no really. OOOOOOOOH!!! MAGIC.
magic!
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Re: burnt out on Wicca?
Fri, February 22, 2008 - 12:33 PMNope. No hat for you. *wink*.....
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